Chipping a Saxon

I have recently gone digital (MTS3 + Massoth Navi) and want to put a Massoth XLS sound chip in my LGB Saxon loco. Ive never done this before so after advice on whats the best way and how easy is it. Now I know that more modern locos have chips fitted or can just plug said chip in. Not sure what Ive got so Ive taken two photos.
This is what it says on the underside of the loco.

This is the circuit board inside the loco

Attached Image(s)

Hi
 
I  have  done  2 or  3  of  these  with  Massoth  XLSounddecoders,
 
It  is  fairly  simple,   The  existing  onboard  PCBs  can be  discarded   as  the  decoder  does  all  the   nescessary  functions,  simply  identify  the   2  sets  of  pickup  leads,  from  each  bogie,  link  these  together  ensuring  that  you  get  the  correct  pairing  ie  left hand  rail  &  right  hand  rail!!
 
Similarly  identify  the   2  sets of motor  feed   cables  and  link  these  together  ensuring  as  above  you  get  them correctly  paired!
 
From  memory  the  cables  for  the  above  are  coloured   Brown, white  , green  &  Yellow., white  &  Brown  are  pickup leads  (  from  track)  Green &  Yellow  are  motor  feeds
 
This  infor  is  contained  in  the  Massoth  decoder  instruction  manual.
 
Then  a lead  from  the  front  light goes  to  connector  mark  LV  similarly   rear  light goes  to  connector  LH.  and  the other  lead  from  the  front  &  rear  lights go  to  connectoor  marked +
 
Cab  light  is  wired  to  L1.
 
Again  this  is  clearly marked in  the  instructions.
 
It sound complicated  but  working  methodically from  the  decoder instructions  is  fairly  easy  AND  the  Saxon  is  an  easy  loco  to  get  inside  of!!
 
EDIT:  Just re  lookng  at  yr  pics  it  is  poss  that  the loco's  wiring  from  the bogies  (  th  4  wires which on  some  locos  are  colored  yellow  green brown  white may  not  be   coded this  way so  it  will just  be  a  case  of  checking  to  see  which of  the  4  wires  does  what which  can  be done  with the  2  leads  from an  analogue  controller  or  a  meter  if  you  have  one,
Your  loc  is a 2001  manufactured one and  there  were  some  wiring  changes made in LGB  production  around  this  time.
 
Good  luck

As the loco already has the "direct decoder" facility, isn't it just a matter of plugging the decoder in to the existing board using the relevant (LGB or Massoth?) interface cable, rather that going to the trouble of stripping out the factory electronics?

In  the  case  of  the  Saxon  the  Direct  decoder  method  is  to  use  2   x MTS 2  (  Or  massoth  equivalent) decoders which  plug into the PCBs for each  bogie.
 
As  a sound decoder  is  being  fitted  the  best option  is  to hard  wire  a  Massoth  XL 3 amp sound  decoder  in to  the  loco.  this  decoder  carries  out  all  the  funtions  of  the  on board factory  PCB  thus  making  it  redundant.
 
The  "Direct  Decoder"  term  is a   description  of  Digtal readiness used  by  LGB  for  some   earlier  locos which  usually  refers  to using  MTS 2  decoders  which  have  the  female receptors ( the  only  way  I  can describe  them sorry) for  the  pins  which  are  present  on  the  PCBs.
 
The  current  description  for Digital readiness  is  symbolised  by a plug  and  cable  representing  the digital plug which fits into  the rectabgular  socket on most  LGB digital  ready  locos  these  days

stevelewis


In  the  case  of  the  Saxon  the  Direct  decoder  method  is  to  use  2   x MTS 2  (  Or  massoth  equivalent) decoders which  plug into the PCBs for each  bogie.
 
As  a sound decoder  is  being  fitted  the  best option  is  to hard  wire  a  Massoth  XL 3 amp sound  decoder  in to  the  loco.  this  decoder  carries  out  all  the  funtions  of  the  on board factory  PCB  thus  making  it  redundant.
 
The  "Direct  Decoder"  term  is a   description  of  Digtal readiness used  by  LGB  for  some   earlier  locos which  usually  refers  to using  MTS 2  decoders  which  have  the  female receptors ( the  only  way  I  can describe  them sorry) for  the  pins  which  are  present  on  the  PCBs.
 
The  current  description  for Digital readiness  is  symbolised  by a plug  and  cable  representing  the digital plug which fits into  the rectabgular  socket on most  LGB digital  ready  locos  these  days

Thanks for the clarification, Steve; so what's the other sticker you sometimes see, with just the six white dots on a black circle (without the "direct decoder" text)? Is that earlier or later?

I take it from what you've said that there is no easy way to wire a single XL/XLS to a "direct decoder" two-motor loco without ripping out the factory boards, then, or at least bypassing them completely?

Thanks for the advice Guys, its a little more tricky than what I though (I was hoping to just plug it in) but hay ho, life's not that simple. Still Im not bad with electrics so will give it a go,
Thanks
Steve........

Nemo


Thanks for the advice Guys, its a little more tricky than what I though (I was hoping to just plug it in) but hay ho, life's not that simple. Still Im not bad with electrics so will give it a go,
Thanks
Steve........

If the lights fail while I am in Matlock I will know where to apportion the blame.   Thought a piccy might help.

Attached Image(s)

Zerogee

stevelewis


In  the  case  of  the  Saxon  the  Direct  decoder  method  is  to  use  2   x MTS 2  (  Or  massoth  equivalent) decoders which  plug into the PCBs for each  bogie.

As  a sound decoder  is  being  fitted  the  best option  is  to hard  wire  a  Massoth  XL 3 amp sound  decoder  in to  the  loco.  this  decoder  carries  out  all  the  funtions  of  the  on board factory  PCB  thus  making  it  redundant.

The  "Direct  Decoder"  term  is a   description  of  Digtal readiness used  by  LGB  for  some   earlier  locos which  usually  refers  to using  MTS 2  decoders  which  have  the  female receptors ( the  only  way  I  can describe  them sorry) for  the  pins  which  are  present  on  the  PCBs.

The  current  description  for Digital readiness  is  symbolised  by a plug  and  cable  representing  the digital plug which fits into  the rectabgular  socket on most  LGB digital  ready  locos  these  days

Thanks for the clarification, Steve; so what's the other sticker you sometimes see, with just the six white dots on a black circle (without the "direct decoder" text)? Is that earlier or later?

I take it from what you've said that there is no easy way to wire a single XL/XLS to a "direct decoder" two-motor loco without ripping out the factory boards, then, or at least bypassing them completely?

 
 Here is one Steve did earlier complete with volume control to keep the neighbours friendly.
 
He must have got it right 'cos it works.

Attached Image(s)

Zerogee

stevelewis


In  the  case  of  the  Saxon  the  Direct  decoder  method  is  to  use  2   x MTS 2  (  Or  massoth  equivalent) decoders which  plug into the PCBs for each  bogie.

As  a sound decoder  is  being  fitted  the  best option  is  to hard  wire  a  Massoth  XL 3 amp sound  decoder  in to  the  loco.  this  decoder  carries  out  all  the  funtions  of  the  on board factory  PCB  thus  making  it  redundant.

The  "Direct  Decoder"  term  is a   description  of  Digtal readiness used  by  LGB  for  some   earlier  locos which  usually  refers  to using  MTS 2  decoders  which  have  the  female receptors ( the  only  way  I  can describe  them sorry) for  the  pins  which  are  present  on  the  PCBs.

The  current  description  for Digital readiness  is  symbolised  by a plug  and  cable  representing  the digital plug which fits into  the rectabgular  socket on most  LGB digital  ready  locos  these  days

Thanks for the clarification, Steve; so what's the other sticker you sometimes see, with just the six white dots on a black circle (without the "direct decoder" text)? Is that earlier or later?

I take it from what you've said that there is no easy way to wire a single XL/XLS to a "direct decoder" two-motor loco without ripping out the factory boards, then, or at least bypassing them completely?

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The  round  sticker  without  the  text  means  there  is  an  interface  for  an MTS  dcoder   but  a  55026 cable  is  also  required!
 
Correct  there  is  no  other  way  to  install  a  single  decoder into  a  2 motor  loco    WHICH DOESNT  HAVE  AN MTS 3 SOCKET FITTED  ( THE NEWER LOCOS)   The  symbol  is  the   rectangular  plug & cable +DCC.  if  installing  a Massoth  or  ESU decoder  a Massoth  interface cable  is  required to  fitr  into  the  socket,
 
Actually  hard  wiring  a  loco  with  a  decoder  is  not  so  difficult  just   a case  of follwing  the  decoders  wiring  diagram, after  the  origianl  PCBs  are  removed  or  at  least   isolated  from  the  locos electrical  system

WOW  KEITH  IS  IT  REALLY  THAT  POWERFUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

stevelewis


WOW  KEITH  IS  IT  REALLY  THAT  POWERFUL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It will pull more than that. I gave up at 86 axles.
Bear in mind that the track is level.

Right then, me chip arrived the other day so its time to make a start...
This might be the last photo ever of me loco in one piece ?

Attached Image(s)

Photo with lid off, I've been told I don't need the loco's circuit board, so that comes out.

Attached Image(s)

I thought it would be best to strip the loco down as I have to cut a hole in the bottom of the loco to fit the speaker and to let the sound out.

Attached Image(s)

Nice one Steve.  Lots of piccies and simple explanations please.  Got one to do too.

Nemo


I thought it would be best to strip the loco down as I have to cut a hole in the bottom of the loco to fit the speaker and to let the sound out.

Wouldn't cut a hole rather drill a series of holes about 5 mm like spokes Steve

Philbahn

Nemo


I thought it would be best to strip the loco down as I have to cut a hole in the bottom of the loco to fit the speaker and to let the sound out.

Wouldn't cut a hole rather drill a series of holes about 5 mm like spokes Steve

Nice one Phil, I'll do that tomorrow....

Philbahn

Nemo


I thought it would be best to strip the loco down as I have to cut a hole in the bottom of the loco to fit the speaker and to let the sound out.

Wouldn't cut a hole rather drill a series of holes about 5 mm like spokes Steve

You won't need many holes Steve, say 8 or 10.
The sound from the Massoth card is massive.
At full belt it is audible two gardens away!

Nemo


Right then, me chip arrived the other day so its time to make a start...
This might be the last photo ever of me loco in one piece ?

Visaton 5watt or 8watt speakerLOUDWill be listening for it Steve

Hi  Steve  Lewis
 
Did  you  buy   a  volume  control   to  fit  on  yr  Massoth  decoder?
 
I  meant to  mention  it  before  they  are  quite  inexpensive  and  do    allow  easy  volume  control  wthout  having  to  alter  the  volume  CVs    I fitted  one  to  Keith  Ts  Saxon  and  it  protrudes  into  the  cab  via  the   hole  where  the  switch used  to  be! To  assist in  turning  it  I adapted  a panel pin  and drilled a  small hole thro the control knob  to  form  a  'T'  bar,
 
Keith  will prob  advise  if  it  still  works  OK??
 
Regards  The  other  Steve  Lewis